The 3 Jobs of Corporate Innovators – Innov8rs Chief Hans Balmaekers

Fred Schonenberg
Hello everyone, and welcome to the VentureFuel Visionaries podcast. I'm your host Fred Schonenberg. On today's show, we have Hans Balmaekers, who is the Chief of Innov8rs, a global community dedicated to empowering corporate innovators. Hans has been leading innovators for over a decade and he's been instrumental in creating platforms for collaboration, learning, and driving impactful changes within organizations. VentureFuel is a proud sponsor of innovators. We've greatly enjoyed learning from the corporate innovation leaders that are part of that community.

And today we're going to talk a little bit about Hans's journey. I'm going to try and pull from him three top secrets he's gotten from the corporate innovators he's listened to and worked with over these 10 years. And then I would like to talk about the upcoming Innov8rs Conference that is this April in Phoenix. So please join me in welcoming Hans. Hans, welcome to the show.

Hans Balmaekers
I'm glad. Thank you for having me. 

Fred Schonenberg
So to kick things off, could you introduce yourself a little more thoroughly than I did to our listeners? Maybe give them a little bit about your background, your journey into the world of corporate innovation, and what led you to create innovators. 

Hans Balmaekers
Absolutely. And let me start kind of going back in time, indeed, more a decade. 27, I joined a Dutch multinational. So for about five years, I was in a corporate innovation role. And in those five years, I felt the pains and gains of being an innovator. You know, some things went really well. We got a lot of support. We activated a lot of people. But equally, a lot of things didn't go that well. There was a lot of resistance, a lot of politics, a lot of kings and queens in business units that didn't necessarily care about the corporate innovation strategy.

So in those five years, yeah, I learned a lot about when and how innovation works, but maybe more so when and how and why it often doesn't work. And there were so many moments that I wish I could call someone, you know, have conversations with people in roles like mine to just talk about, hey, how are you approaching certain things? How do you deal with certain issues? And such a place didn't exist in those years, to my knowledge. And that's what I set to create once I left that organization back in 2011.

Fred Schonenberg
I love that. And it's so funny. I often go to a conference or we go to a city for something.

I will try to get dinner together. And I'll bring together usually like our clients from that city and reach out to other folks that are in corporate innovation roles. And I did that just as like, oh, this will be an interesting thing. And I realized that the intense power of them coming together for them to talk, because they're in the same trenches, they have the same problems. And in a lot of ways, a corporate innovation role is kind of isolating. You're the disruptor within the bigger machine. And so I found this just tremendous sense of community when we did this right ad hoc. And so I can say just from personal experience, I've seen the power and the need for what you're doing. 

Hans Balmaekers
Now, totally. And, you know, innovation sounds sexy and glamorous, right? If you talk about it at a birthday party. But for those of you listening in, I mean, you know, if you're actually kind of living in on a day to day basis, it isn't that sexy, right? It's on the one hand, it's still quite a new field. If you compare it to maybe supply chain or marketing or finance, you know, there is still a lot to be gained when it comes to how do we actually do this successfully at scale.

And equally, as you say, you know, many people in the company don't really understand it, don't really maybe even want to understand it, right? Because you're asking for things that kind of maybe are even a threat to them. So there is a lot of pressure to perform as well, building on what I just said. So you could say that, yeah, bringing people together, there's an element of, you know, learning, there's an element of connection and a little bit of therapy as well.

Fred Schonenberg
I'm laughing about the therapy comment, because that's also part of it, because it is, you know, you're pushing a boulder up a hill sometimes. And it's nice to know there are other people pushing in different organizations. 

Hans Balmaekers
True. Yeah. Yeah, I remember we had a conference back in 2016, 17 in Stockholm. And, you know, there was this, I think it was a guy from the UK government coming into the room, and he, you know, he said it out like, oh, this is where the crazy people go, you know. So, yeah, that's really what most people are missing within the walls of their own organization. 

Fred Schonenberg
Absolutely. So one of the things I love about this podcast, and we've had over 250 episodes at this point, and like, I joke that it is like an MBA for me in how to do corporate innovation, because I get to talk and listen to all these folks. I suspect now I've gotten to participate in innovators, you have this almost on a weekly basis where you're bringing together some of the brightest minds in the space. Could you share some things about corporate innovation, maybe your top three, that you didn't know when you launched Innov8rs that kind of like you would share if you were at a birthday party with somebody that was just starting in this field? 

Hans Balmaekers
Yeah, I would say, of course, indeed, with Innov8rs, both at our conferences, our community membership, our collab program, we've worked with thousands of innovators and across industries, you know, over all those years, indeed, there are a few things that became clear to me. And maybe the most important thing is that I'm not sure if its three secrets, but I would say that the innovator typically has three jobs, right? 

There is the day job, which is the innovation work. That's really coming up with new products and services, business models, that's maybe introducing new technologies. That's the core, that's the innovation work. Of course, at that level, you always need to show progress, you need to make sure that you get to the goals.

And there's a night job as well. The second job is really getting support, getting buy-in, stakeholder engagement from, you know, CEO and leadership to maybe shop floor or other stakeholders across the business. 

And then there's a third job, the weekend job, and that is almost like changing ways of working. How are things done? For example, how do we, you know, do accounting for innovation? How do we integrate technology? How do we scale pilots? How do we change the culture? So I would say that's the most important part. Innovation has these multiple layers, these kinds of three jobs. 

And, you know, at one point I said, you always need to have a split personality, you know, to do the job well, because you need to, you know, look outward, look forward, but equally, you know, there's a, you need to have a strong foot in the now, you need to have a strong foot in what's happening internally in order to make that work. So there's a lot of dynamics that you need to manage across these three, the three jobs that I outlined. 

Fred Schonenberg
I'd love that. I was talking with somebody about basically finding talent in different roles, right? And I said, look, if you want to find somebody that would be great at sales, you should go find an innovative person. And they were like, why? And I was like, they know every single person in the company, and they're constantly selling, there's a new way to change it. Let me socialize this thing, right? Like there is a whole night job, weekend job that goes with the work itself. And they have to be so connected and spend time on that.It takes a really rare personality to thrive in this role. 

Hans Balmaekers
Yes, absolutely. And that's also, I remember we once worked with an innovation manager, a large German company, and he told me he was so surprised. They had this well-designed, as you can imagine, German company, they often had very well-designed processes, well-designed innovation programs and processes, and everything was quote-unquote right. And then they sent a few folks to, I think Stanford or some prestigious institute for design thinking training. And they kind of thought that with that, everything would happen kind of flawlessly and successfully.

And of course it didn't, because they did not kind of do the second and the third job, right? The whole influencing, the whole people component beyond even the training, beyond the processes and the programs, that's kind of an unmissable part of corporate innovation. Absolutely. 

Fred Schonenberg
Yeah. And it's interesting. I've seen the other side too, where you have the people that have the big ideas that kind of can find the new technology and have this ability to bring in the disruptors, but they don't have the process and they don't have the ways to measure it. And it's sort of a flash that then disappears. So it's very unique. 

I have a question totally off script, but as you were talking, obviously you're a global organization. Have you seen any big differences between either sections of the world or countries where they're very good at some part of innovation and another where they're better at a different part? Is there any sort of, obviously it's unique to each company, but curious if there's anything you see between Europe and the US or anywhere else that comes to mind when I ask that.

Hans Balmaekers
I would almost say that the biggest differences are company cultures more than, let's say, country or regional cultures. It may be true that for some years, the employee-driven entrepreneurship movement was a bit stronger in Europe. Maybe, yeah, there is maybe this culture of kind of rolling this boat together. In some ways, maybe the Asian culture was more top-down and that also has a different, let's say, that has an impact on how you do innovation. If it's less, let's say, democratic, more top-down, that is different. So I wouldn't be able to say yes to that question. There are distinct differences in, let's say, the US versus Europe. I think company culture plays a way more dominant role in that. 

Fred Schonenberg
Makes sense. So let's turn our attention to Phoenix. You've got an upcoming Innov8rs conference. Is there a theme for this year and why is that particularly relevant given where we are with corporate innovators in 2025? 

Hans Balmaekers
Yeah, I think you mentioned one of them and maybe to start, we never have one very kind of fixed team in the sense that we always look, hey, what is working now across industries? What is important? What are folks struggling with? We, of course, are getting a lot of feedback, a lot of insights into, hey, innovation teams, what are they working on? Where do they need help? And that's how we designed the program.

But the one thing you alluded to was results. So, of course, in the current economic climate, the political context, there is a lot about focus on the now. How do we get results? Maybe in the next year, maybe in the next three years, but let's forget about moonshots and all the fancy things that innovation was maybe, quote, unquote, known for or innovation was designed to do maybe five or 10 years ago.

So it's all about how do we get results now? It's about performance. The years of innovation as the fancy coffee machines and the beanbags, it's over. The theater and all the things that we have been accused of playing, whether or not that's correct. I have mixed opinions on that. But yes, it's all about the now. So that is a core team for the Phoenix conference. How do we get results in the shortest term possible? Thinking about that day job, how do we show that we're actually doing a good job? Obviously, we'll talk about how AI is influencing innovation management, as well as how we innovate for AI, which, of course, it's still dominating the conversations as well. 

But equally, there are evergreen topics that we cover every conference simply because they are so much needed. Everything from how do we measure innovation? How do we showcase our results? How do we do portfolio management? Where do we invest? How do we invest? How do we structure innovation? There's been a lot of reorgs in the last months in many organizations.
How do we organize innovation centrally at the corporate level and then the business units or regions have their own bits and pieces? Or that's been a little bit of a wave. Do we, again, do everything decentralized? So how do we do that? That's another evergreen topic. Innovation culture remains one of those things that many are working on.

I don't think any company really masters. So that is another topic. Storytelling, how do we talk about the night job and the weekend job? How do we influence? How do we get things to change to support innovation? So I would say, yes, there are some current teams when it comes to performance and delivering results in the short term and AI, but evergreen topics are on the agenda as well.

Fred Schonenberg
Yeah, it's really interesting. When I first entered this world around the same time that you launched, I was amazed by the lack of results and tangible measurement that was happening at that point in time on the innovation side. And I often joke that it felt like a startup petting zoo.
It was like corporations would bring in these startups and all the executives would come down from the top floor, see them all, and then go right back to their day job. And it was like, hey, go do some things. And your beanbag comment made me laugh so hard.

I remember sitting with the CEO of a company and watching him get into a beanbag. And it was just like, he was so uncomfortable, which was sort of the point. But it was also just like, nobody was focused on how they were going to generate revenue or return. I was like, we have to commercialize this. This needs to be about tangible results. Or if things change, it's going to be discontinued. So I love that as a focus area for this. And I think I talk often that you need jump shots to get to the moon shots. You need those steps.

You need those wins to get permission to still swing for the big transformational moves. So I love this. Is there anything about the conference that you feel is very unique that you want to highlight besides the speakers in the sessions, maybe the way that you structure it or how you run workshops or things like that? Just curious what you kind of hang your hat on for making it something special.

Hans Balmaekers
Yeah, totally. And the reason that we host the conferences is really for folks to learn and get those insights to go back to the organizations and implement. And as well, as we alluded to earlier, it's also about connections and speaking with folks that are in the same boat, facing similar challenges, chasing similar objectives.

So that's also why at our conferences, there's only a few plenary talks. So that's really the morning of day one, where we set the scene. We talk about some of those current topics and the evergreen topics, and then we go into breakouts for the rest of the conference. So one and a half days of breakout sessions, discussions, case study talks, workshops. We even go on field trips. So we hop on a bus, and then we go to some of the innovation hubs in the area, in the region.

So yeah, the conference is really designed for folks to learn and for folks to connect, and that's why we have those different breakout formats throughout the two days. 

Fred Schonenberg
Yeah. I think what's very interesting from perspective too is getting to be hands-on. I mean, even though we're excited to have our session, which the title of it is our innovation diagnostic, but really what it is, is how can people fine tune their innovation programs to get the tangible results we mentioned? And it's been really fun, because a lot of times I'm at conferences, I'm just talking, and this is like, no, let's be able to do a workshop where they bring in real problems, and let's come out. So no matter what, they're leaving with something that helps them in their job. And I noticed that that's a theme throughout, that it's very applicable.

And you also have practitioners. I know one of our clients, Biogen, will be speaking about some of the amazing work that they're doing. And I think that's so important for us to hear how people are doing things differently. Obviously, each organization is differently, but you can always steal like an artist, right? You borrow the things that are working that would work for you, and sort of build your own mosaic as a corporate innovator. So I love it just looking at it ahead of time. Are there any practical takeaways that attendees, anyone listening that maybe is on the fence, that you think is a compelling reason for them to sign up? 

Hans Balmaekers
Yeah, I would say that maybe that's to add on what I said earlier, and also to respond to what you just said. We offer folks a personalized agenda. That means that you bring your goals, your needs, whatever is important for you and your team. And at this point in time, whether that's the now, whether that's AI, or whether that's some kind of a program that you want to improve, you share as a participant, you share your input with us.

And then we suggest to you, hey, these are the sessions you would want to join. These are the people you want to connect with. Right? So that when it comes to takeaways, it's not necessarily a kind of a, you know, take it, take it or leave it or one size fits all agenda, because also corporate innovation isn't right. So that's the, I would say that the conference really allows you to work on whatever tops your to do list. So on the content level, I would say it's not a motivational, inspirational type of event. Right? It's really targeted to what you want to work on.
I would say the kind of the I see this picture of this, what is it the wheel, you know, the, the square wheel, and then there's folks with this, the round wheel, and don't be too busy to innovate, how you innovate, of course, linking back to the team of we need results. Now, the last months, if not years, but the last month for sure, every innovation team, every innovation professional, they've been so busy, so busy to, there's not even room to breathe, you know, and I would say, I understand two days is a bit of time out of your agenda. But it does pay off.

Because yes, you learn a lot in terms of like, hey, how can we improve? How can we tweak? How do we make sure that we get the results you learn from so many people from across industries on stage, but also in the room, right? So there's a lot of kinds of insights and very tangible input that you can translate directly into the work so that yes, you do spend two days out of the office, but you will be equipped with, you know, tools and practices to improve what you're doing. And also the two days out of the office will kind of rekindle that spirit, because yes, there's a lot of reorgs, there's a lot of innovation labs and programs and things shut down. And of course, that impacts more real as well.

And if you're still in a corporate innovation job, that's a good thing, because at least you know, you survived the kind of the stopping and the shutting down of some of those initiatives last year. But then don't forget to also, you know, kind of stay kind of motivated, get some new energy, join a conference to meet with all these people have from other organizations in the same boat, a little bit of therapy, but especially some good laughs as well to, you know, to kind of be re energized. So I would say there's a content answer to your question, why would you join but also for sure a connection and a personal motivation and relationships angle to that.

Fred Schonenberg
Yeah, it's, it's so funny. And I agree, like it's there is a community therapy piece of it. But also, it's really cool. Yesterday, I hosted, like you do, a learning lab. And we were talking and I showed some stats that we had pulled in research, and it's 83%, or 84% of senior executives say that innovation is one of their top three priorities. And so it's like, this is not that innovation is going away, right.

But they also feel I think it was 3% feel like they're equipped to deliver on that priority. So this isn't like just because things are getting tight, and people are streamlining their organizations, it's not that innovation isn't a key focus, and they don't want to invest in it, they just need to be able to measure it. And they want to see, how do I pull results from this, your point of the shorter term wins, or at least the justification, right, like the signs that this is going to be big.

And we talked about it a lot. It's like, you don't have to hit the moonshot the first six months, but you have to show reasons to believe you have to say, Hey, like this is, we've gotten here. And this is where this is going next. And, you know, I think what's really cool about being around your community is there are people that have different levels of experience in this, they've seen the cyclical nature of it. They've gone through the trenches, they've stepped in the potholes, and they can say, Hey, don't worry about it, you need to do this thing. And so you come back, not only feeling a little re-energized, but with some applications you can put towards your day job.

Hans Balmaekers
Amen to that. Absolutely. Yeah.

Fred Schonenberg
So where can people go to learn more about the conference and sign up for innovators? Absolutely. So first of all, just type in innovators.co. So I-N-N-O-V-8-R-S dot co. You'll find it on our website, our yearly handbook. It's one of those, you know, we call it the Bible for innovation management. So that's one free thing to download right away. And then innovators.co slash Phoenix is where you'll find yourself on the agenda, but also the 16 or so corporate innovation leaders that we feature from brands like 3M, DuPont, you know, so the agenda is there, you'll see what you can engage in.

But again, also, you'll see a short video, you know, from folks that were with us last year in LA. One of them even said something along the lines of like, oh, I should have done this way earlier. So yeah, innovators.co slash Phoenix is where you can find information about the conference.

Fred Schonenberg
Amazing. Well, Hans, thank you for sharing your insights with us, talking to our audience, and for anybody listening. I hope you sign up and go to Phoenix. I'll be there. We look forward to seeing them all there in person. And thank you for all you're doing to, you know, spark change in the world of corporate innovation.

Hans Balmaekers
Likewise, and thanks for having me on the show today. 

Fred Schonenberg
All right. Thanks, Hans.